NO SEX!!??!!??!!?? What kind of crazy training is that! :D JK
But on a serious note how important is celibacy during this time period? I have heard many different theories, the most logical one being that one should exercise some common sense and not screw right before you go train. Some are very stringent about this part of the training though. Would like to get your opinions.

Well Richard you are most too kind. I am no expert per se, but I will tell you this.....Biggie's jiu/jow is the ****! It is the best I have come across so far, and I have tried many a different roach juice. I have heard Pattersons is quite good, but just have never have ordered any.

Cheers
Jake :D

Mike Biggie jiu/jow
 

The best I have used. I have placed an order for the herbs and eagerly await UPS. Like Richard said, Mike is a busy guy but always returns my calls. He is class act and a treasure for those in Oh-ten.

Jake

Deals with essence, jing you know. You would have to have an in depth knowledge of Qigong to understand it. I am sure you do.

Jow works, no doubt about it. Each herb in the formulae has a specific function. Most Iron Palm forumuaes have over 20 different herbs. Basic jows for bruising can have less.

I Have also learned that one jow does not fit all when it comes to iron palm. I am sure most will do fine but it is better to get one specifically for your students. Some forumuales are for warmer cilimates or summer use or colder or winter use. It may not make alot of difference but if you are going to use something why not do it the best way you can with the best medicine.

Most people who make the formuales understand this and will make adjustments as needed

I get my forumuales from someone who has a TCM practice and Trains in CMA. That way I know I get the best.

"Iron Palm" is to broad of a term to be able to discuss on a forum. First off Internal or External iron palm? Which style of internal or external?

Not hurting your hands is a worry, but just because you have not hurt your hands does not mean you have not or are not injuring yourself. It is more complex than that.

I have found that most who do iron palm are just doing a very basic level of external training. That is all that I have done myself. I would like to do the higher levels but can not make the comittment yet. But, I can educate my students enough to know that this type of training is more complex than just banging the bag.

Most would be just well off to slam the makawara with the okinawans. They can hit hard.

Any body ever read this book
 

Has anybody ever read the book Shaolin Long Fist by Jwing-Ming Yang? There's a page or two about Red sand Iron palm, in which the last stage is to strike heated sand, or iron filings. Then use a jow that would other wise be poisonous. The end result is and iron palm, and sterility. I don't train this, but have wondered about it for a wile. Has anybody else heard about this, or are able to add anything to it? Also any body ever hear of Takamatsu Toshitsugu? he used to strike gravel until he could turn it to dust, then strike mediums sized rocks, then large stones, and was said to have mastered it by the age of 14 (he started learning it at 9). I have seen pictures of his hands, and his finger nails alone look like their a few centimeters thick (as do his toe nails). I have heard stories stating he was able to drill his fingers into trees, as well as rip the bark from them as well.

Well the bodies main point is to reproduce. So the body will replenish the semen before repairing any injuries sustained to the body. So the older you get the longer it takes for your body to replenish the semen. A young person can maybe get away with not cutting back on sex during this training. But an older person might want to cut back on sexual activities to help your body heal faster during this training that is taxing on the body. That is the deal with the sexual issues and training.

It is to my understanding that Iron Palm training teaches you correct soft jin, how to penetrate through resistance, and to stregnthen ligaments, bones, and tendons.

Like any other technique, there are various levels of penetrating through animate and inanimate objects. Driving through and breaking every brick or object is the beginning. Controlling the pressure, direction, and distance of controlled inertia is advanced.

In regards to using Die Da Jiu. Impact resistance is no different from mucular conditioning. The muscles, bones, ligaments, and tendons, all undergo controlled damaging. The intensity of your training determines the amount of rest and nourishment required. It won't kill you if you don't eat after hard trainning. But if you want the body to develop more efficiently, eating within the 20 min. window will prevent catabolism.

With intense impact resistance, the damage causes stagnation of damaged and "rescue" cells. The Taoist have a saying, "If it's stagnant, it's dead". Using Die Da Jiu enforces the habit of massaging the body and reaping all the benefits from such stimulus. Again, it is not required because the human body is the perfect machine. But like all machines, it can be "dumb" at times. The greater the intensity, the more the body will compensate. Die Da Jiu helps the body heal so the body won't have to compensate.

While the technique may be learned in 100 days, it will take a minimum of 6 months for the bones to become "iron" based on the bones ability to reach equilibrium with the amount of stress placed upon it.

Ultimately, Iron Palm/Iron Body trainning includes progressive overload, variation, nourishment, and requires time, effort, and patience.

Dos centavos,
M.

Impact Training
 

First and foremost, anything in excess is not a good for sure. So discipline is key in any training.

Western medicial knowledge and perspective is different from eastern counter part. Chinese philosophy, which influences its medicine, views human as part of a larger whole. It is part of nature and unavoidably under the influence of nature or various levels of ecology. It is for this reason that Qi as a model is so important in everything Chinese be it philosophy, medicine, military, arts and pugilism.

Impact training (ie Iron palm, Iron body, etc) is in essence hard Qigong. It has direct effects on the body and will cause damage in the long run if not dealt with utmost care. Other martial arts like Boxing, Muay Thai, etc don't pay much attention or believe in minding the Qi aspect and we can see the results in the countless ailments that their stylists suffer once they slow down in their old age. If you look at the Chinese arts, you will notice the difference. The point is that impact training should be for strengthening the body or its parts not to break it. So due care should be exercised through out the training process. That's why we have the 3 returns 9 rotations method, Pai Da gong, 18 Luohan, etc.

Boxer don't believe in Iron palm and such things and they often break their hands when punching hard without the protection of the glove. Their argument in seeing other martial artists not breaking their hands while punching is that those guys aren't punching hard enough. Be that as it may, I am certain that people who have trained both ways understood there is a difference with trained hands and non trained hands.

Anyway, I don't go crazy on the whole making your hands hard. I believe hitting the palm bag, heavy bag, gravel pot, and the occassional hitting the walls are good enough. I understand the urge to break bricks and such but then if one has to go to find the "right" material for breaking, I think it's twisted into more or less an ego trip. Personally, I believe that you can punch or strike hard (really hard) bared handed while fighting without the fear of breaking your own hand is good enough.

Different styles has different Iron palm potion formula. We have to remember that the training is to strength the skin, the muscle/tendon, and the bones of the hand. There are also the issues of blood and Qi circulation and pain threshold. A good formula will take care of all these issues. Most Iron palm training and the potion formula would involve rusted iron and/or vinegar. This is basically for toughening the skin. If you are not too worry about the skin (ie cuts and scrapes), then this ingredient is not really that important and can be skipped IMHO.

Mantis108

Mr. 108

Come on!!

We know you slice though one foot of steel reinforced concrete!

You are just being modest.

Would anyone like share their iron palm training regemine or key aspects found within?

An interesting bit of information:
Zinc promotes and aids healing in the body and seminal fluid has a high content of zinc (unless you have fertility problems). Loss of seminal fluid depletes available stores of zinc that are better used for healing the micro-ruptures caused by iron palm training.

Supplementing with zinc tablets would offset this but there may be more involved than this alone.